‘Agatha All Along’ Creator on Directing Patti LuPone’s Mind-Bending Episode, Revealing [SPOILER]’s True Identity and Who Is Really Dead

As a writer and lover of storytelling, I find it truly fascinating how creators use narratives to explore complex topics like death. The approach taken by the team behind “Agatha All Along” is both poignant and respectful, offering a unique perspective on an inevitable part of life that we all must face.

CAUTION: Plot Spoilers Ahead: The following narrative discloses significant events from Episode 7 of the series “Agatha All Along,” which is now available on Disney+.

Jac Schaeffer wasn’t supposed to direct this week’s episode of “Agatha All Along.” 

Originally planned to direct the first two episodes of the series, the creator and showrunner was instead compelled to take charge of episode 7 due to a scheduling conflict that unexpectedly vacated the director’s position for that particular episode. As a result, Schaeffer took on the role. This series continues the tale of the captivating witch from “WandaVision” (2021), brilliantly portrayed by Kathryn Hahn.

“I was thrilled,” Schaeffer says. “It was a script that was really close to my heart.”

Titled “Death’s Hand in Mine,” the episode spotlights Patti LuPone’s exceptional performance as Lilia Calderu, a divination witch traveling on Agatha’s coven’s journey known as the Witches’ Road. During this trip, Lilia has randomly exclaimed phrases like “Get off me!” and “I hated this the first time!”, which seemed to hint at some deeper understanding. Written by Gia King and Cameron Squires, the episode uncovers that these instances, which Schaeffer calls “Lilia’s moments of dissonance,” are in fact demonstrations of Lilia’s unique ability to move between various time periods within her own lifetime.

In this episode, we journey alongside Lilia, moving across different time periods, and it becomes clear how each of her statements were connected as she starts to recognize their link. This revelation unfolds just as the coven attempts to tackle their latest challenge: They find themselves in a castle tower, dressed as storybook witches – Agatha as the Wicked Witch, Lilia as the Good Witch from “The Wizard of Oz,” Jennifer as the hag from “Snow White,” and Billy as Maleficent from “Sleeping Beauty.” Their task is to accurately read a full Tarot spread. Any mistake triggers one of numerous hanging swords to fall, while the ceiling itself gradually sinks, pulling all the swords down with it.

In due course, Lilia comes to understand that it is her own self who requires the tarot reading, as opposed to anyone else within the coven. At this realization, she experiences brief glimpses of crucial instances throughout the series where she had mentioned specific Tarot cards – either “the High Priestess” or “the Tower reversed”. When Lilia reveals the last card, she is suddenly reminded of the moment in Episode 4 when she found out that Rio Vidal (played by Aubrey Plaza), a former lover of Agatha who joined the coven, was actually Death – more famously known as Lady Death from Marvel comics.

Because the Death card symbolizes her journey’s end, Lilia realizes that her time has come to an end. When the persistent witches known as the Salem Seven, who were after Agatha, started showing up at the castle, Lilia guided the rest of the coven out of the tower, stayed behind herself, and then turned the Tower card over when they arrived. As a result of magic, gravity reversed, causing the Seven, along with Lilia, to fall onto the ceiling covered in swords.

In this installment, we can say it’s packed to the brim. However, Schaeffer skillfully conducts “Death’s Hand in Mind” so that its emotional depth brings out a stellar screen performance from LuPone. Schaeffer shared insights with EbMaster about the intricate aspects of creating this episode, including character appearances based on fairy tales, unveiling Rio Vidal’s true persona, whether Lilia and other witches have truly perished, and what viewers should anticipate as we approach next week’s two-episode finale.

How did you arrive at the idea of weaving Lilia’s premonitions into the series? Did it start with her being a fortune teller?

From the outset, she was clearly a fortune teller. The specifics of how we made it official escape me, but I recall an overwhelming feeling in the room where it struck me, “Alright, we’re going to create an episode that isn’t linear and scatter clues from earlier episodes throughout it. This show is already complex enough, and now I’m adding this additional layer, which seems reckless, yet I can’t resist. Let’s give it a try!” That’s the impression I got from the meeting.

Did you you write Episode 7 first and then take the pieces of it and sprinkle it into the earlier episodes? How did that work?

As a movie reviewer, let me share my experience. To tackle this project, I enlisted the help of two talented individuals, Cam Squires from “WandaVision” and Gia King, who proved to be an invaluable asset in our collaborative sessions. While they primarily worked independently, their contributions were skillfully woven together, forming a cohesive narrative. Once we had the foundation set, additional details were filled in to complete the story.

How did you weaving in the bops into the early moments?

As a movie enthusiast, I had marked “This is going to be a Lilia’s standout moment,” only for the dialogue to evolve as the script progressed. The one line we modified on the spot gave me quite a scare, as I pondered, “Will this line blend seamlessly?” It was none other than “I love you guys” from Episode 3. We discovered that it didn’t quite match up. There was a slight disconnect in the emotional flow, but I believe we managed to salvage it effectively.

Did you work out a linear timeline of how the episode actually unfolded?

Absolutely. When arranging events or information, it’s important to maintain a chronological sequence. While there’s a time paradox involved, as Lilia learned something from Jen earlier that Jen actually learned from Lilia later, this inconsistency can be difficult to reconcile completely. However, if we look at the overall picture, the sequence generally makes sense when put together.

When did you bring Patti into the process?

As a passionate cinephile, when I first brought her on board for the episode, it held its own charm, but the moment Patti LuPone joined our team, it became apparent that this needed to be something extraordinary. This realization led us to meticulously refine the mechanics of the episode while simultaneously ensuring that every emotional beat resonated as intended.

What sort of feedback would she be giving?

She delivered several soliloquies, and as we approached, I slightly modified some of them. She then approached me and asked, “Could we just follow the original script?” To which I replied, “Of course, you’re in charge.” She is a theater performer who values the written word. I was attempting to expedite our progress, but she insisted on delivering every line. Fortunately, she did, and I’m grateful for her dedication to the script.

There are really two different tracks in the episode: the linear timeline as the other characters are experiencing it, and the emotional timeline as Lily is experiencing it. How did you and Patti navigate that?

Patti requested a clear sequence of events in the script, as this would help her follow along and grasp what she needed to do. Although she generally had a good grasp on it, she sometimes got confused slightly. Her main concern was locating the key emotional moments and determining when she should fully express herself. This is why she wanted the episodes laid out sequentially, but I pointed out that it was her character who was jumping around. Since Patti’s character remained consistent throughout, it was appropriate for her to feel deep emotions whenever the tugging around occurred, as her character was being pulled in various directions. Therefore, it seems that her approach was finding where the constant pulling began to expose her vulnerability.

So how did filming all of this work throughout the season?

According to our plan, we were supposed to film Lilia’s catchy tunes today. We needed to pause during setup, position the light behind her and adjust a particular camera lens. I can’t quite remember its name, but it created a soft, dreamy effect. These are the tunes where Lilia only sings part of a sentence, which we will later combine with other parts.

Later on, we encountered situations similar to Tarot scenes, which proved to be particularly tough since some initial ones were filmed without the actual designed tarot cards. It was my assistant, Brittany Horn, who brought the tarot cards to life through her art. This was advantageous as she was present, allowing me to say, “Let’s make this tarot card resemble the shot we’ve already taken.” For a few others, we had a bit more freedom in the design process.

For the earlier episodes, were you stepping in to direct just the bop moment you needed for Episode 7?

Absolutely. This series featured quite a bit of behavior where individuals would join, take their share, and then depart abruptly. It was particularly challenging for us because our program is hands-on in nature. While we do incorporate traditional VFX techniques using blue screens, it’s important to note that unlike some shows, we didn’t create any background settings using Computer-Generated Imagery (CGI). Instead, we already had the necessary assets at hand.

What was one of the biggest logistical challenges for you while filming?

Coordinating transitions – aligning them shot by shot. This involved working with a document containing images of our footage, enabling us to select the appropriate lens and frame size for each scene. It was this aspect that required my utmost attention. I’d like to briefly acknowledge my team members. Kimi Weber served as my main script supervisor, and my progress would not have been possible without her. My associate producer, Ishi Metkar, functioned as an extension of my own mind.

An additional challenge we faced during this episode was the intricate practical aspect. The swords used were authentic and suspended on piano wire. This required careful numbering, arrangement, and placement before any actors entered the set. As a result, we created a detailed map of sword positions, which was quite complex. Ishi served as my sword assistant, ensuring both of us remembered these details. Remarkably, the actors were gracious and agreed to abide by my instructions, such as standing in specific spots to prevent accidents caused by straying swords potentially striking them in the face.

How did you decide what each witch’s fairy tale look would be?

It was incredibly enjoyable! I suspect Maleficent arrived a bit prematurely. However, we were eager to witness Joe Locke amidst all the turmoil. In this installment, he’s brimming with self-confidence, and we wanted that vibrancy portrayed on screen. We desired to show him strutting around in an elegant gown, adorned with a stunning headpiece and full makeup. That scene represents his current phase. He’s exhibiting a hint of arrogance – he’s not tolerating any nonsense from Agatha. We’re pushing hard towards that dynamic. Furthermore, Agatha embodying the classic wicked green witch was fitting, and as always, our main cultural reference to “The Wizard of Oz” novel was evident.

We chose Lilia to embody the traditional good witch character for several reasons: Firstly, Lilia plays the central role in this episode, saving the coven and resolving the trial. However, she also challenges common witch stereotypes, which made us believe that her displeasure with her outfit would accurately reflect her true self. On the other hand, Jen’s heroic color is pink, and she sees herself as a very feminine, beautiful character, often dressing and behaving like a princess. Therefore, we felt it was fitting to portray her in the crone look, aligning with where her storyline currently stands.

Why is Lilia still using “Teen” or “Teenager” for Billy’s name?

At that moment, in her linear experience, she doesn’t know that he’s Billy.

So she knows that he’s the Scarlet Witch’s son, but she doesn’t know what his name is?

Indeed. It’s when he seems to understand her thoughts that everything falls into place for her, and suddenly, she recalls the bar mitzvah.

The area where Lilia and Jennifer first land, with the subway station — what is going on there? It almost seems like it’s halfway under construction?

To remind you, in Episode 3, Mrs. Hart mentions a half-built and then-abandoned public transportation system for Westview that was in progress but left unfinished.

Oh, I forgot about that!

You forgot one line in Episode 3?! For shame, Adam! For shame.

Will the show return to that location?

Let me just take a moment to do some math in my head. I’m afraid we can’t revisit that specific location. However, as with everything on the show, what you witness always matters significantly.

Lilia, Alice, Mrs. Hart — are they all really dead?

I’ve been pondering the question that might come up today, and I’ve given my response some thought. Essentially, our show revolves around the theme of death, featuring a character personifying Death itself. This topic intrigues me greatly, particularly in its depiction within comics and the Marvel Cinematic Universe. On a personal level, I believe that even after someone passes away, they continue to be with us, both emotionally and spiritually. However, death is unchangeable; it’s permanent. Our intention with this show was to honor that solemn aspect of life. As such, our discussion on death will likely be more profound and serious compared to what you might find in other superhero productions.

So are the Salem Seven dead?

Indeed, all members of the Salem Seven have passed away. In essence, they’ve been eliminated from our series, and it’s thanks to Lilia that everyone is safe!

Lady Death has been a significant character in the Marvel Comics for a long time. When did you decide to include your version of that character in the show?

It’s quite exciting discussing this! We aimed to introduce a character who would be chasing after Agatha and her coven. The rationale behind this was that if Agatha has a problem, once she forms a coven, the issue becomes common to the entire group. Right from the start, we conceptualized this character as the Debt Collector, given that witchcraft is deeply rooted in intention, exchange, and balance. Later on, we shifted this character’s pursuit from unpaid debts of witchcraft to death, finding it intriguing. We then thought, who could be a better ex-lover for Agatha Harkness than Lady Death? It just seemed so fitting and natural.

Mary Levanos, as executive producer, and Giovanna Sarquis, the writer, played significant roles in shaping the character. Giovanna introduced the Dia de los Muertos theme and made her a Latinx character, while Mary had a substantial impact on Rio’s complex darkness, his toxicity, and the intricate relationship between Rio and Agatha. It required approval from the higher-ups, Kevin [Feige] in this case. There was a tense period where everyone was on edge, fearing we might not receive the approval. We were ecstatic when we finally received the green light.

You said Rio is a “pursuant character” — is she a villain, or at least an antagonist?

Indeed, she fits the role of an adversary. It’s worth noting that throughout the series, every character takes on both villainous and heroic roles at different times.

Next week is the two-episode finale. With “WandaVision’s” finale, you experienced the challenge of some fans theorizing about possible endings and surprise cameos — like Mephisto or Doctor Strange — and then being disappointed when they didn’t happen. So what would you say to fans about where their expectations should be going into the conclusion of “Agatha All Along”?

Over the past few weeks, I’ve delved a bit deeper into our show discussions, as we intended for it to gain momentum significantly during its second half, much like “WandaVision”. It’s intriguing to observe the audience’s reaction to this development. So far, it appears that viewers are following the path we had envisioned. It’s not about specific characters appearing or surprises, but more about delivering on the emotional aspects that the audience seems drawn to. There will be more of Agatha and Rio, a resolution to our story, and some truths about Agatha will be revealed. I wouldn’t dare predict what viewers should expect in the end. Instead, I am simply grateful for the invested interest the audience shows in the emotional narrative of our show.

This interview has been edited and condensed.

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2024-10-25 19:18